Join us as we delve into the remarkable flying career of Celine Lorenz, a passionate paraglider who took to the skies at a young age. Discover how a tandem flight gift sparked her lifelong love for flying, leading her to save every penny for her license and equipment. Celine shares her early experiences, from working at her mother’s refuge in the Alps to fund her dream, to the determination that drove her to skip school for training. This episode captures the essence of Celine’s adventurous spirit and her unwavering commitment to flying which lead her to compete on the World Cup and the Red Bull X-Alps, competing this year for the second time. Celine shares her personal experiences navigating the race’s formidable challenges, from daring flights over rugged terrain to the mental resilience required to overcome setbacks. Discover how Celine’s strategic mindset and adaptability played a crucial role in her adventure, leading to unforgettable moments and lessons learned. Enjoy this inspiring tale of courage, determination, and the spirit of adventure that defined Celine’s race.
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Celine, thanks for taking the time to sit down with me. It looks like you're traveling. You got your great little van there, and I'm excited to talk to you about your race and flying and life. How are you?
Celine Lorenz (00:53.848)
Thank you so much. Thank you so much that I can be here. I'm great. I'm now on my way to France with the van. And yeah, I'm also looking forward to talk with you now.
Gavin McClurg (01:04.334)
Is Van home always or no?
Celine Lorenz (01:07.79)
Quite a lot, yeah. I'm spending a lot of time on the road and a lot of time not at home. yeah, it's something like home, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (01:18.405)
And you you do tandems typically in the summer with Ernesto on those guys in Garmisch, is that right?
Celine Lorenz (01:24.718)
Yeah. And now like last summer and this summer, it's a bit less because always the slots were a block for tandems. It's always shit weather, but normally in summer I either teach a bit and fly tandem.
Gavin McClurg (01:38.749)
How did you get into all this? I don't know your backstory that much. You and I had a quick chat before the 23 race and you you told me about your boyfriend, that crazy accident. So I know a little bit but how did you get in all this?
Celine Lorenz (01:55.054)
Like no one of my family and no one of my friends in my childhood was flying so I never really had a like a contact with that in the beginning. But for my 11th birthday I got a tandem flight as a present from my mom and because we were living close to Kösten and it's always full with paragliders so yeah I got that for birthday present as a surprise and
It's funny because I think two or three weeks ago, I rewatched the video from my first flight and it was so cool. I like this really sparked everything like this put. Yeah, it was just crazy. This feeling for me. And from that moment on, I collected every cent, every euro I got into my hands to be able to do the license when I was 15, 16, to be able to finance a license and my first equipment.
Gavin McClurg (02:32.856)
cool.
Celine Lorenz (02:54.753)
because also at this time I was working a lot already at the refuge of my mom. She has a refuge in the Alps and I always help there on the weekend and I put a little box on the counter, like with Celine's paraglider, so the people could put some sand or euros in. As soon as I had collected everything, yes, yes, yes. And as soon as I had...
Gavin McClurg (03:15.229)
Little piggy bank, piggy bank for your passion.
Celine Lorenz (03:23.477)
all the money I went into the paradigm school like with a bag full of like small money. And I was like here I want to do my license. And they were like, are you sure you don't want to be like have a look for one or two days to check it if you like. And I was like, no, I am. Yeah. And then it all started and I just spent all my time in a paradigm school. I, I in the school, like in my real school, I said I'm sick to be able to be on the training hill to fly.
And yeah, it was since then, I'm, yeah, all about flying. I'm 26, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (03:59.806)
How old are you now?
Gavin McClurg (04:04.106)
So 15 years ago, right? think that's more or less right.
Celine Lorenz (04:08.243)
Yeah, 10 years. 10 years I start like since 10 years I'm flying my own, since 15 years I'm... Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (04:11.847)
Ten years, okay.
You bet. Yeah, but you did the tandem 15 years ago. So you were super and you were living there in Kosen and you're in the Kimsey zone. I mean, what a perfect place to learn how to do this. Doesn't get much better.
Celine Lorenz (04:29.707)
Yeah, that's perfect. It's a very good area to learn.
Gavin McClurg (04:35.185)
Yeah. And then when did you get involved with Nivihek?
Celine Lorenz (04:40.013)
With Niviök, I'm since 2022. Yeah, it started 2022 and then...
Gavin McClurg (04:46.105)
Okay. And was that
Gavin McClurg (04:51.325)
And that was because of PWCs and racing. I mean, it wasn't for hike and fly yet, right?
Celine Lorenz (04:54.731)
Yeah, because now in the beginning, I did the Dolomiti Superfly in that year with the climber already. And then I also started to fly competition with the peak. And yeah, and then everything came up.
Gavin McClurg (05:14.045)
And before the 23 race, was the, was the X-Alps always on your radar? You know, was this something that was, that fascinated you from the beginning and you were working towards, or was it more, oh, I think I should just do this kind of, yeah.
Celine Lorenz (05:24.941)
Mmm.
Celine Lorenz (05:33.006)
It was like when I started paragliding in 2015 and the paragliding school, was always like, was at around the time of X-ups. There was always the live tracking of the X-ups in the room. we were always like, it was already there when I started paragliding in that summer. And there I was like, boy, it's crazy what they do and it's unreachable. And I never thought that I gonna be part of that.
And for sure, it would have been cool. Like I thought for sure it can be cool to be part of that, but it was like something where I thought I can never reach that. Like it's too far away. And then, yeah, now I'm was in mixups already the second time. It's crazy. Yeah. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (06:18.813)
Mmm.
Gavin McClurg (06:27.207)
Crazy, that's so cool. I don't know that many people know this about you. I certainly didn't. I know you've got a huge background in Acro, but whenever I tied in with your team, both times, last time, but especially this time, I spent more time with your team and you, on days that weren't great, like day two, that kind of thing.
you know, when I asked them how she doing, how's her headspace, and they always said, it's great, it's awesome. And you are just, yeah, I've got that. mean, you're a very confident pilot. Is that your acro background or, I mean, you didn't seem, I have very often seen athletes in these races who have been pretty overwhelmed and you never seemed overwhelmed. You seemed like this was just your jam, you were digging it.
Celine Lorenz (07:24.062)
No, for sure. It's also it gets mental in situations like this. And day two of this year's edition was. It was tough in some moments, just after the takeoff, I had a really sketchy situation just close to rocky face. And there I was really quickly like it was very like short. Or how do you say? I don't know. I was really thinking like I just stopped.
It was really, really close to the wall where I got a collapse. But I managed and I had a little casket, but it was okay. And there was like, okay, now I just look for a safe landing. then I just like breathe the bit and I found the focus again. And then I went around the corner. was like thinking like, where am I now? I'm fully under Lee. Okay, that's...
Gavin McClurg (07:56.348)
limit.
Celine Lorenz (08:20.897)
That's why this happened and then I could explain. For sure it was also maybe also the fern was not the best moment to fly, but I could found like I could, I know why I wasn't the situation. And then I just went to the good place. I found a good thumb and then I breathed a few times and then it was all good again. I found the focus again and then I was like, yeah, it's all good and it feels good. then.
I continued and then I found the focus and it was really good. I don't know. for sure, think also the acro helps for sure. If you know how to handle a wing and a lot of situations, for sure that helps.
Gavin McClurg (08:54.237)
I mean you just
Gavin McClurg (09:08.093)
23 you had a disappointing early exit because your foot and
curious what you learned from that, what you changed going into this one. It certainly seemed, I was just talking about this with Simone who just did his fifth one and coming in as a rookie is just so much. mean, there's so much anyway as a veteran, there's so much. I imagine there's lots of things that you could go, yeah, I would do that differently. how did you approach
this time, this edition differently than the first time.
Celine Lorenz (09:47.79)
On the first time I really like, I really trained too much because I was always like comparing myself with all these guys and I knew that I'm not like body wise and on my feet, not that strong than as the guys. So I was really comparing too much, even if there's no room for comparison.
There I trained too much and I had already some pain in my hips on the last exercise because I was a bit in overtraining. And I also broke my back six months before the start of the race. It was a compression break. It was not with metal inside, but at a compression break. And this was all adding like I was not in the best shape for the 23.
Gavin McClurg (10:28.717)
I didn't know that. What happened?
Celine Lorenz (10:45.238)
But
Gavin McClurg (10:45.534)
How'd you break your back? What happened?
Celine Lorenz (10:47.469)
I was flying with the acro wing and also not on a really good day. It was a bit bumpy and then I just came in for landing a bit on the lee side and it pushed me down a bit and it was just a lot of sink and I thought, yeah, I can break it. And I didn't went out of the harness completely to stop the impact with my legs. And I was like crashing with the S, just it was nothing. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (11:14.962)
but so it was minor, but it still affected training and stuff. Do you use a trainer or do you do it all yourself?
Celine Lorenz (11:17.119)
Nothing too crazy, yeah.
Celine Lorenz (11:24.555)
Yeah, I have a trainer in Innsbruck. Yeah. And for this time, yeah, yeah. And for this time I changed that I also listen more to my body. If I feel like something is a bit hurting, I just put a break and listen more to my body and don't come into overtraining. That was a big focus of myself to not do too much, to be really in everything I can give for the race.
Gavin McClurg (11:27.196)
Okay, great. I find that helps a lot.
Gavin McClurg (11:56.115)
Right before, I can't really remember the exact timing of this. I don't know if it was before the prologue or for the main race, but I was following your feed and I don't know how much of that is you doing that or you had a media person, I wasn't sure, but you had a post that said, fly like a woman. What does that mean to you? I loved that. But what does that mean? I mean, it's gotta be.
intimidating I would think. You know, it's you and all the guys in this race. What does that mean to you?
Celine Lorenz (12:20.685)
It means to me to also try to empower women to fly and to empower them if they want to do something that they should go for it and that they should just believe in themselves.
and also try new things and if they want to try something tricky because some guys say like, but you think you should do that, they should just go and do it even if they are a woman, you know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. If they feel good, yeah, yeah, they should go for it.
Gavin McClurg (13:04.318)
Okay, so ignore the chatter. Go with what you feel on the inside.
Gavin McClurg (13:13.742)
I like that. I got to spend a really wonderful hour with your team in St. Moritz. I think you had just left. You were heading back up to lunch and I talked to Teresa into having a beer. They weren't supposed to, but we had a really nice afternoon together. How did you choose your team? She's not a pilot. I guess you guys went to school together in Innsbruck. She is lovely, by the way. My gosh.
Celine Lorenz (13:13.836)
Yep.
Celine Lorenz (13:27.327)
Yeah.
Celine Lorenz (13:39.629)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (13:42.046)
What does, how did you choose your team? And was it different than in 23?
Celine Lorenz (13:47.758)
Yeah, it was a bit different. The only one who was already there in 2023 was Tim. Tim Umgewitter. But I really kept an eye on this time that everyone is super motivated and that I also know them personally and that I already have a connection with them so we can also handle stressful situations when it gets tricky, when everyone is tired and pissed maybe and so...
It's better to handle that if you already know the person a bit, I think. And I really kept an eye on that I have really motivated and good people for me. And with Theresa, she's an angel, really. She's from heaven. Yeah, met her in Innsbruck. We had a co-location there together. She studied and I did my...
Gavin McClurg (14:30.93)
Yeah, she is from heaven.
Celine Lorenz (14:43.711)
Like I was working as a pastry chef in Innsbruck and yeah, it was a really good time. yeah, she's just such a good person. And I really wanted to have her in my team. Like she called me like, yeah, I'm not flying, but, and I'm planning my holidays for this summer. And do you think it's like, can be an option that I'm part of your team? And I was like, yeah, for sure. I was so happy that she asked me. And yeah, I'm really glad. for everyone. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (15:08.613)
cool.
She is an angel. You could just tell her energy is just, I just wanted to wrap her up every time I saw her. She's so lovely.
Celine Lorenz (15:13.645)
Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And it was for everyone in my team. really like I'm super grateful and everyone is good in their own stuff. And we were just it was like a puzzle. It was really good. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (15:32.122)
Take us through, these are the unsung heroes, right? And I talked about how important it is with Simone. And as a former athlete, I know how important it is. These people are so critical to your success. How many did you have, and what were their roles?
Celine Lorenz (15:38.551)
Mm-hmm.
Celine Lorenz (15:51.182)
I had five supporters with me. was Tim Ungewetter, he was the main supporter. He was there to have the overview. With the routing, he was looking for the weather. And that was his main job. Then I had Noé Kuhl, a Swiss guy. He was also so good. He was routing a lot.
and she was hiking with me and kicking my ass on the hike. Yes, yes, yes. Yep. Yep. Yep.
Gavin McClurg (16:24.24)
He's a really good hike and fly athlete, it? Right? No way. You say it differently than I would say, OK, gotcha. Yeah, wow. he'd be fantastic.
Celine Lorenz (16:35.241)
Yeah, he's the best. Then Anton Zöcke, was also like, was mainly also running with me and hiking and being my shepherd. And then I had Daniel with me also, he was there with the camera and doing content and for social media. And Theresa, she was a physio and a good soul.
cooking and yeah, and for sure with the drive. Yeah, Tim and Theresa both were also driving the cars. And yeah, it was very good. And I also had Reinhardt in Switzerland, he was doing the meteor for us. Every evening we had a meteorologist who gave us a big overview of the weather and
Gavin McClurg (17:06.312)
Morale, she was there for morale.
Gavin McClurg (17:23.239)
remotely.
Celine Lorenz (17:32.501)
of where we were and what could be the option for the next day for the route where we go to.
Gavin McClurg (17:39.71)
How was that? Did you use that in 23 as well? Did you have that both times? Okay. How was that? Did you enjoy that? Did it help?
Celine Lorenz (17:43.906)
No, no, it was the first. It, it, it helped. Yeah. Because we spend less time to have our like forecast for the next days. it was cool to have it, but for sure the weather is always like where you are now and you look outside. Like it's always a bit different than in the forecast forecast is still the forecast, but it was good to have. It was good to make already a plan for the next day to have like a little overview.
Yeah, so it was helpful.
Gavin McClurg (18:15.391)
Yeah, I didn't have one in 2015, which was my best year, my first time. And then I learned that Gaspar Petio had one, and was a guy that had done it since the very beginning. He'd done it for some teams since 2003, Laurent. And he was amazing, and he worked for Medio France and lived in Chamonix and really understood the race. But how you process that information, think, really, in 2017...
Celine Lorenz (18:34.221)
Mm-hmm.
Gavin McClurg (18:41.343)
both Gaspard and I used him and Gaspard used it to his advantage and for me it didn't work at all. It was really interesting because it would put, well it's supposed to be like this in my head and it removed what I'm naturally good at, which is reading the sky and doing my thing and we did it again in 2019 and then I didn't do it in 21.
It doesn't have anything to do with the results, but it was interesting because I actually didn't enjoy it. It didn't work for me. And that was, think, probably my own weakness. yeah, I kind of liked it better when my team was doing it. Because they know me really well, and they know how.
I tend to do better when it's nasty. And so when it's nasty, they wouldn't say directly it's going to be nasty, but I could just tell. Rather than having the forecast that just sounded impossible. Anyway, that was an interesting thing for me.
Celine Lorenz (19:39.978)
Yeah.
It's interesting.
Gavin McClurg (19:44.64)
Because I just talked to Simone yesterday on the podcast. That's just kind of fresh in my mind, but you know, he's done so well all five He's never he's always been sixth or better. So he's kind of cracked the X Alps code if you will He was saying one of the most important things is knowing your strengths and playing to your strengths Kregel talks about this as well and Thomas Terrella who he who he worked with for years said, you know, it's You have to work on your weaknesses, but you really have to play to your strengths. What are your strengths? What are you? What where are you strong?
Celine Lorenz (20:12.653)
I think I'm strong in being like a friend of mine. said it like I'm like a husky. She compared me like this. I'm not like a wind dog. I'm not super fast. I'm not fast on my legs, but I'm like a husky. I keep on going even if it's shit and hard. Like I'm just biting through. Yes. Even if I...
Gavin McClurg (20:38.879)
I
Celine Lorenz (20:42.505)
If my body hurts, I'm like, I'm getting just, I'm just keep on going like a tractor. And that's my strengths. can just bite through a lot, I think. And yeah, for sure. Also my, my flying is, I think I am confident with my flying also. Yeah. So.
Gavin McClurg (21:03.017)
So when it's rowdy and it's on the edge, that's a strength. It doesn't freak you out. You've got it. mean, obviously, paragliding is scary sometimes, but I think that's important to be strong in those situations because it's very rarely recreational flying in this race.
Celine Lorenz (21:20.223)
Yeah, for sure. Yeah, for sure. It's sometimes really scary and sketchy situations. But then I think I'm good in trying and keeping the focus or getting the focus back and just try to focus on the moment and to be like as safe as possible to.
Gavin McClurg (21:40.178)
Anybody who saw the race and even anybody who tuned in for very little time knows about your epic adventure heading in towards. I don't know what that the vice horn, but something horn and you know, the east of the Eiger. You know, so you're over the FERCA and you're heading towards the Nissan turn point. So.
anyone can go back who was listening to this and see, know, Red Bull did a great clip on it and there's all kinds of drone footage. was just, you had an epic and that was unbelievable. mean, of all the people in this race, you had the greatest adventure, I would say. And you know, when they did the interview with you, you said a lot of things like, it was shit and it was fucked. But I imagine now that type three fun has probably changed and you're probably glad you had that adventure. What I don't know is what happened.
Celine Lorenz (22:12.341)
you
Gavin McClurg (22:32.361)
Did it was it cloudy? Did you miss the thermal? How did you end up down there?
Celine Lorenz (22:37.293)
It was a tricky day. Normally it was starting quite well. I had some good thermals, the cloud base was a bit low, but I tried to get everything as what I could get. And I also took the route which every guy took, or a lot of guys took. And I wanted to win for the same. It was at Grimselpass to cross over Grimsel Lake and then...
continue flying to Nissen. And yeah, I knew that Kriegl also did it a bit lower and he could catch something. And I was not that high on the crossing and I was like, okay, I keep on going, I go for it. But I didn't really thought about the fact that the guys who took that route went there earlier in the day, like on the timing. So
I didn't calculate, I knew that Grimsel is windy. It's known for that. But yeah, it was windier as I expected. So, but I thought like, go in the lee side because there was a very nice cloud above that ridge where I wanted to cross over. And I was like, yeah, it need to work. Like this cloud is building. It looks perfect. Like picture perfect thermal cloud building up. And I was like, yeah, this
the lee side needs to work. It's a really good day. It was really strong also. So was like, yeah, it needs to work. But the lee side was just flushing me down. And because I was like, yeah, should I go to the north and with the wind and then catch it and take the thermal or I tried the lee side. But yeah, it was really bad. And I was just like, I just saw the lake and
all like rocky and all full of trees. There's not really a track like the track is going in the tree. So it just pushed me down. then the moment where you already like know that you go a bit more in front in your harness and you're really intentional, you're like, it was really, yes. And it was just really not nice. And then I thought like, yeah, but I needs to work like this clouds and it's odd, but no.
Gavin McClurg (24:48.575)
breathing and...
Celine Lorenz (25:04.149)
It was really just like the deepest sound I could ever hear from the value was there, really like, and then, yeah, I was really not so nice. And I could see also the wind with the trees in the valley or with the bushes. And then I was not really thinking of. Like, not really looking for the tracks, but I was just looking for a safe landing there in the valley. And I went there, it was a.
small little field with some beautiful turquoise glacier lakes and I was like yeah it looks pretty it looks good it's not like it was the best place in the lee side to land because the other side was a bit rocky and also really windy so I was like yeah I land there safe and then in the first moment I didn't realize that it's a really shit place that I'm stuck there and
Gavin McClurg (25:44.809)
Safe.
Celine Lorenz (26:02.163)
Then I restarted the search to cross the river there from like a glacier river. And it was a really strong river also, because it's a very huge glacier there in the back with a lot of water. And we searched so long and we tried to find a path in the front and it closed to the lake because I thought the river is spreading there. So the energy is more spread and maybe it's better to cross there. No.
And I also already thought to swim in the lake, but there was so much like currents and I was like, no, and it's super cold. Then we hike like I, then I got a call from one of the accepts Arga. He was like, yeah, I safe. And they said like, yeah, you, cannot really exit there. Are you really sure you're safe? And I said, yeah, I tried to find a way. And then it was funny because then.
I was hearing like a drone. was like, I couldn't see anything. And then I saw this drone and I was just waving and I didn't know from who it was, if it was from the orga or from a tourist or from someone. But it was funny because in this moment I didn't feel so alone. was like, yeah, someone sees me. Yeah, yeah, I'm not alone. And then, yeah, then the local.
Gavin McClurg (27:17.465)
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They know I'm out here.
Celine Lorenz (27:29.057)
guy from the refuge there in the valley called me and he said like in Swiss German dialect he said to me like yeah you landed in a beautiful place but you never get out of there again and I was like
Yes, yes, yeah. So we were really close to call the helicopter and I was like, no, there needs to be a way. And then we said, like, he said the only option is maybe to go all the way back to the glacier and to find a way there. And because we already also thought to climb up on the side of Mürin or how do you say, like on the side of the glacier, Mürin, yeah. But there was so much rockfall, so it was really bad.
Gavin McClurg (27:48.338)
Enjoy. You're trapped, but have a nice look around.
Gavin McClurg (28:12.051)
Yeah, the Marine.
Celine Lorenz (28:17.345)
because it was a thought to climb up the murren and just fly over the river to the other side and land there and go out. But it was crazy. Like the rockfall was crazy. then we just went all the way back to the glacier. And what was also really not so good was that my supporters then also came into the valley and they were on the other side of the river. And the good side was the path. And we couldn't really talk to each other. We were screaming.
Gavin McClurg (28:21.95)
Yeah.
Celine Lorenz (28:46.775)
but it was too loud, we couldn't hear us. So we couldn't communicate and then we tried to call, but there was no connection anymore. So we just tried to find something and then we went all the way back. It was like seven kilometers or something. And then we found like a bit sketchy bridge of rocks and was, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (28:48.362)
much noise here.
Celine Lorenz (29:10.881)
bit sketchy but we could cross it and then yeah we made it yeah and we were super happy but it took us seven hours in total to exit that valley and I would have never thought that I was like we are in the Alps there are tracks everywhere there's some people everywhere normally but nope
Gavin McClurg (29:28.105)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (29:33.953)
Yeah, it is remarkable how deep it can get, even in the Alps. Did you, that route, the Grimzal, I don't know what we even call that, but I was up on the Nisen that day when Kriegel pushed in there first and then kind of had to turn around and come back out and the rest of the group caught him up. But was that the plan for you all? I I didn't do a lot of route study this time because...
Celine Lorenz (29:40.437)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, but it's cool also.
Gavin McClurg (30:03.562)
wasn't competing. But when I was on the Nissan and I saw him doing that, I went, wait, what? What is this line? That just wasn't on my radar at all. And maybe if I'd studied the, I mean, it's obvious, it's direct, but was that the plan originally? It was, okay.
Celine Lorenz (30:14.477)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Celine Lorenz (30:18.489)
Yeah, I had it in my, like I had it, but I was not sure if it works. And then the guys in front did it, but for sure it works, but the guys in front did it and it works really well. So I was like, cool.
Gavin McClurg (30:31.89)
Okay, yeah, I blew the commentary on that one before that because I thought, you know, they would go either back door into Grindelwald or stay with the Feast line and then up and over at Loeckerbad or something. I just, I didn't have that on my radar. That was very cool. But as you proved, also not without its risks.
Celine Lorenz (30:41.037)
Yep.
Mm-hmm.
Gavin McClurg (30:59.744)
Celine, and you could do either 23 or 25, but give me the ultimate best memory and the ultimate worst memory. The high and low from your two campaigns. And maybe they could both be from this race, I guess, but whatever pops into your mind.
Celine Lorenz (31:15.98)
Yeah.
The worst from this year was on day two, where it was just with the phone on the after the takeoff of the first flight, like of the flight on day two. I was really it was really it was I had a really big collapse with stalling and in the least side it was not good. So that was the worst.
Gavin McClurg (31:45.182)
Wait, wait, is this from when I saw you up at Sexton, that flight or the next one?
Celine Lorenz (31:50.062)
The next one. Yeah, this was... No, was actually the second flight on day two. Yeah. So this was the worst. I could also say the landing there in the valley because it cost me a lot of time, but there I was feeling better than when I got the call-ups. And the best moment was I think landing in...
Gavin McClurg (31:52.959)
Next one, because that looked lovely from the sextant. Everybody that launched there, looked great. OK.
Okay. Okay.
Celine Lorenz (32:20.055)
St. Moritz. It was really cool. It was really nice because we had a good day. My team was happy. There were some people. I had some pastry afterwards. It was really good vibe. It was really cool moment there in St. Moritz.
Gavin McClurg (32:35.655)
that, you mean going on the way out. You had a huge flight that day. You took off from Murano and made it all the way to St. Moritz, right?
Celine Lorenz (32:38.602)
No
Celine Lorenz (32:42.709)
Yes, yes, yeah, that was a super nice day. it was day three. Yeah, that's really good.
Gavin McClurg (32:46.848)
Wicked. Yeah, that was a, but that was a really phenomenal flight. I mean, you did that in like five or five and a half hours. You were cruising.
Celine Lorenz (32:57.195)
Yeah, it was really cool. It was really good. Yes, I really enjoyed that day. Yeah, was really good. And on the 23th.
Gavin McClurg (33:00.349)
Yeah.
Celine Lorenz (33:12.193)
For sure. I don't know if I can also count the pre-week in this because I trust my ankle in the pre-week. So this was a really bad moment of that episode.
Gavin McClurg (33:19.488)
Mm.
No, I forgot that. That's right, you did that before.
Celine Lorenz (33:25.453)
I just twisted my ankle in the pre-week. Like in the shooting. In the pre-shooting. Yeah. That was really bad. Yeah. And one of the best moments of the 23 was...
Gavin McClurg (33:29.32)
Yeah.
God, that's just a mental crusher. He's just going, what have I done? So much effort.
Celine Lorenz (33:51.691)
Hmm.
Celine Lorenz (33:57.42)
When I first I fucked up a flight from Achental towards Lermos. The first flight I was really a lot of east wind and I bombed out in the Intal and then the flight afterwards towards Garmisch was really nice because I just had one thermal like I made I think 1500 height meters just in one thermal straight up like in one group.
And then I flew to Garmisch to my home and there were so many people. I know, I think when I was walking through Garmisch, we were like a bubble of 20 people walking through Garmisch. And yes, and that was really cool. That was a really cool moment to have all my friends there and everyone cheering and yeah, it was cool.
Gavin McClurg (34:36.865)
Nice parade.
Gavin McClurg (34:49.959)
Is it, how much of an advantage, disadvantage is it to know a place? Yeah, it it was, it's interesting that, you know, like Aaron Derigatti this time, his knowledge of a place in Murano really kind of hurt him there. You know, he, he, he decided to go to the standard launch, which was really in the Lee on that day too, you know.
pretty ferocious, fern conditions and yeah, it was just a bad call and it hurt him. It didn't end up obviously hurting him that bad. won the race, but the people who weren't from there did what was logical. They went over on the windward side on the other side of the valley and was still strong,
Celine Lorenz (35:32.781)
Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (35:34.146)
pretty exciting flying, it was the right thing to do. And we see that a lot, right? We see it all the time in the World Cup. We always talk about, you know, it's never the local hero that wins. It's somebody that doesn't know the place. how, I'm curious, because the Alps are so big. You know, this route is so big. I mean, you can't be an expert on the whole thing. Well, maybe if you're Kriegel and you've it this many times. how much, you know, like being,
really knowledgeable about the Kimzee and the N-Tall, like, I'm not sure if I'm saying that right, and Garmisch, that area, Lermouz, does that really help? Do you think it really hurts?
Celine Lorenz (36:12.685)
For me, it hurts. I'm also not a big fan of scouting your route a lot before the race because it's so much different in the race. And a valley can be so different in so many different weather situations. So you can be there in the spring and scout it and you have like super strong spring thermals. And then you can be there in the X-Ups and it's fun or it's rainy or they can...
Gavin McClurg (36:15.55)
Interesting.
Gavin McClurg (36:21.141)
Mmm.
Celine Lorenz (36:42.005)
mix of whatever and then it's completely different. So I'm not a huge fan of scouting and knowing the place very well. For me, I'm also more a fan of going somewhere and flying logical and just use what you have there at the moment. And also on the 23 edition on Steinplatte in Austria, normally that's also like kind of a home spot. And I was also flying the
normal route which is always flown and where I was already flying a lot and I bumped out. Yeah and it was hurting myself a lot also so I really like to fly on places which I'm not really know like where I was not flying a lot before because then you just take what you have at the moment and I think you should always fly like this but at the moment like in the valleys you already know it's different.
Gavin McClurg (37:41.538)
What kind of headspace do you try to bring to the race? From what you learned in 23, one of the things I have found fascinating is I'm almost kind of an historian of the race now at this point. I've watched so many years and then I did it and then now I'm on the other side doing the media side of things. But I think it's fascinating that I used to always make the argument that the reason Kriegel was so dominant was because he has
so much experience in all of the things. He was an acro champion, he was a World Cup champion, he's ferocious about his training. mean, he's got the greatest tools, right, in his toolbox.
Again and again, we're seeing that it's not necessary to be a World Cup pilot. Paul Kuschelbauer has never been a World Cup pilot. Tom Dodorlodow, Simon Oberhoudner doesn't do World Cups. And Tommy, maybe they do them every once in a while. I don't follow them that closely, but it's not, I used to always think that it was really important to know how to fly really fast in the race on those good days. We saw that in 2013 with Kriegel and Aaron.
and just stomping out front that first day down the pins gout. that doesn't seem to be, when I look at my own.
I think that hurt me being a World Cup pilot. I don't do a ton of World Cups, but for the last 10 plus years, I've done quite a few. And I think what often really hurt me in the X Ops was flying too fast, was not just doing everything I could to stay in the air and getting impatient. And Simone talked about that. That's kind of his key is just being so patient and just flying really slow sometimes and making sure you stay in the air.
Gavin McClurg (39:33.501)
Anything like that for you? Because you're a World Cup pilot, you know how to fly really fast. You're going down right now to train on your X1 for the Worlds. Helps? Hurts? Do you have to just totally shift your mindset?
Celine Lorenz (39:48.91)
I think it's like good if you can learn how to switch your mindset. It's cool to learn in the World Cup and with competition, can learn to like, to you can learn better to read the air, I think, because you have maybe a plan in your head if that could work or that could work. And then you have like a hundred people there, you see the air and then you were like, oh yeah, could my plan work? And what I maybe think in front and then you have
a lot of people who show you if it could have worked or not. So you learn a bit to read and faster, I think, in comps, better than when you just go and fly alone or with your friend. But for sure, you also need to shift. And that is also was a bit my problem also in this time that sometimes I was not patient enough. There was a bit too much in the competition mode from, yeah.
And I was like, no, like go back into the hike and fly mode, be more patient, scratch, stay. Like it doesn't matter how long you stay on the space and you search. If you find something, you're way faster by scratching you one hour. And then you are able to cross the ridge or if you bump out now and you have to work around this ridge, it's just way longer. yeah, it's, I think it's the competition flying can help a lot to learn.
for X-ups or high-key fly races, but you need to be able to switch. And I think that's what Krillig is good in. Like he has his tools, but he has a really strong mind and he can, he's really strong with his mind and with switching the modes.
Gavin McClurg (41:35.009)
part of this flying game thrills you the most? What do you like the best? Acro, World Cups, hike and fly, camaraderie, the community, what is it?
Celine Lorenz (41:40.525)
Bye bye.
Celine Lorenz (41:45.55)
I think it's the mix of everything that it's so like, so you have so many sides of paragliding. It's the, for me, I think I could not just stay in comp flying. could not just be full on hike and fly. I could not just fly full on acro. And I really liked the mix of playing with the air and with the wing and with, and yeah, just, yeah, do so much different stuff with the wing and the air.
For me, it's what's really attractive to do. It's really cool.
Gavin McClurg (42:20.99)
You had the minor back injury before six months, I think before 23. Have you had other accidents?
Celine Lorenz (42:30.409)
No, like it was the biggest what I heard on my body and flying. never broke a bone or anything at some twisted ankle or some scratches from some bad landings, but I never broke anything.
Gavin McClurg (42:44.642)
What do you chalk up that to? That safety, that's pretty good. A lot of people have been pretty hurt in this sport. is your approach?
Celine Lorenz (42:54.413)
Thank
Celine Lorenz (42:58.797)
I always like when it gets sketchy or when I'm feeling like not really safe, like I'm always thinking like, okay, in the end of the day, I still want to be safe on the ground with my team and Xlabs or whatever with my family back home when I'm coming back from a competition, I'm always having the thought like, okay, I want to sit there, have a dinner with them. So what
should I do now to be able to do that? So sometimes it's just more safe to go land and be like, okay, maybe I'm slower with this, yeah. And I just really, when it gets sketchy, I try to just be in the moment and not try to stress because when you stress and you just be like, what the fuck? You don't have the situation and you just need to...
look around what do you have in which situation are you really like are you in a league are you like how is the clouds how's the wind and yeah it's hard to say yeah but i try to keep the focus and to always prefer to be happy in the on the ground with my friends than pushing a bit more to yeah
Gavin McClurg (44:24.93)
There was a lot of chatter in this race on the social media side of things about the risk, that it's become more of a gladiator thing rather than an adventure. I don't buy much of that, to be honest with just be straight up, but I'd like to get your take. How do you manage your own risk in this race?
I don't know if you were privy to any of that. As athletes, you guys are busy. And I wasn't much either. I was hearing this kind of through the grapevine. But then after the race, I saw a lot of comments. There's a lot of armchair viewers who are pilots, and they understand. everything is seen now.
It didn't used to always be seen. was the helicopter flying around and it was more craft. was a more crafted message. Now with the teams like yourself, you have your own media people, everything goes out or can. And so people see a lot more. so anyway, what's your take on all on that side of things, but also for your own per, you know, how do you feel after the race? Do you think?
Celine Lorenz (45:16.863)
Yeah. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (45:41.664)
that was too much or this is really on the edge or is it all fine?
Celine Lorenz (45:47.214)
I think I'm happy with my own decisions. think for myself, I didn't take too much risk and for me, I took safe decisions because I think also in general, the athlete itself can take the decision if he's taking off or not. The guys are very experienced and they can look in the air.
and they see in what they probably take off into. And that, for example, day two on XF and also in the end of day one with the thunder. I think it was quite on the edge. when you saw some videos and.
For me, that's maybe also, maybe it's a bit risky to say, but it's also a bit...
How do I say it right in English? It's maybe also a bit driven by the testosterone of the man who is now pushing more and has the bigger balls. I'm sorry to say it in that way, but yeah, sometimes I think it's also a part for sure. And that can get very like on the edge.
I just hope that nothing more serious is going to happen in next editions. But yeah, for sure, every athlete is responsible for their own decisions. They can, they see in what they're to take off. And if I think if you put more rules, it takes a bit the type of like the adventure. In the end, it's the adventure race, but maybe there should be a shift in general for the pilots.
Celine Lorenz (47:46.349)
to also say no to shit conditions because, yeah, it was just shit conditions. Yeah.
Gavin McClurg (47:55.971)
But what I'm hearing from you is it's not really on the organization to control these things. It's really to fly is always a personal decision, right?
Celine Lorenz (48:06.893)
Yeah, for me, should not be from the organization side. For me, it should be like, yeah, no. No, yeah.
Gavin McClurg (48:11.168)
Yeah, I'm glad to hear you say that. Well, because it would radically change the race. It would be a huge, it would not be the Red Bull X Alps. And this is my main argument. It wouldn't be the same thing. be a different race.
Celine Lorenz (48:28.417)
No, yeah, that's true. And for me, think there should, there really need to be a switch in the brains of the guys who do this risky stuff. Cause I don't know what's some, there were some really sketchy situations and yeah, sometimes for me it's for sure they're really skilled pilots also. But sometimes you can be skilled.
but it's also a lot of luck sometimes.
Gavin McClurg (49:01.132)
Yeah, yeah. It was interesting. I had this conversation with Tom Dodordo just a week ago about this exact thing. you know, so he was with, you know, David's launch that went super viral. He was with that group. And then he was later with some of those, you know, some of the guys that took off in Murano when it was screaming. It was really, really, really strong. And
You know, most of those launches did not end up going out. They were kept private, but he had them. And I got to see some of them. you know, Patrick Von Cannell made it look really good. And that's just skill. It was just as rowdy for him as it was for the couple pilots who did it before and after. And I've talked to those pilots too, and they've all said, yeah, you had better skills than I did. But I mean, he just made it look
easy. know, I think that's what every athlete has to work towards, right? You know, that, okay, that this is on the edge, but I have this move. Not, hope I have this move. That's very different thing. You know, I would have been one of those going, I hope I have this move.
Celine Lorenz (50:16.397)
Yeah, exactly.
Celine Lorenz (50:20.749)
For sure, like skills help in the situations, for sure. But sometimes also the most skilled pilots can have a collapse close to the ground. You don't know before,
Gavin McClurg (50:33.283)
Sure, 100%. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, I mean, the super final that they had in Descentus a few years ago, I heard all kinds of stories of really good pilots getting away with. Yeah, it sounded like luck in some cases. So yeah, it can still go sideways. I don't know if you've thought about this yet, still pretty fresh, but what are you thinking about 27?
Celine Lorenz (50:52.077)
Yeah.
Celine Lorenz (51:04.159)
I'm thinking about 27 already, yes. And I'm already thinking of what I could change, what I would like. For now, I still have a break and I enjoy summer a bit and I train for the World Championships now. But I'm already also having an eye on 27.
Gavin McClurg (51:12.15)
Awesome.
Gavin McClurg (51:23.849)
Awesome. So there was never any doubt you were excited about doing it again.
Celine Lorenz (51:28.969)
For sure, like when you're in the race and it's hard sometimes you think like why am I doing this but then Yeah, I Really enjoy it also Yeah, so I'm looking forward. I don't never know it I get still two years. I don't know what's coming but yeah
Gavin McClurg (51:53.188)
There's a lot of things that make this race special, as we both know. There's a lot of things. One of the things that I always just would kind of blow my mind is the places you find yourself in at certain times of the day that you would just never be doing if you weren't in the race. You wouldn't be on some launch over beautiful morning glory at six o'clock and just.
the most peaceful, lovely, amazing, easy, and you wouldn't be flying around Mont Blanc when it's gnarly and ripping. Yeah, there's a lot of things. So you find yourself in these amazing places, but it's also just everything else, the training and the preparation and the team and the special. But is there anything that really draws you back? What's the most addicting thing about?
this race for you personally? When you're thinking about 27, what gets you most excited?
Celine Lorenz (52:48.183)
Yeah, for me, it's really, as you already said, like this moments where you would have never find yourself if you would not join the race. It's like this hikes you would probably never do the takeoffs where you end up and the flights you have. It's. It's just different with the X-Raps and that's really what keeps me going to do it. It's, it's so beautiful for sure. It's a lot of work around with your team with.
sponsors and with to manage everything and before it's like it takes all your time. But to have this reward with all this nice moments also it's so huge and this is what keeps me going.
Gavin McClurg (53:35.364)
So it sounds like more Red Bull X-Alps boxes to check for you. Celine, thank you so much. I have really been looking forward to talk to you about this after the race, after it's settled a little bit. But I so much enjoyed catching up with you in a few places during the race and your team. And what an amazing campaign.
Like I said, you definitely had the best adventure of anybody. think that was awesome. had amazing footage. Those of you who are listening who haven't seen that, back and dig through it. It's really incredible to see what's going on. I don't remember what day that was, four five or something, but four, I guess. Day five, okay.
Celine Lorenz (54:15.341)
It was day five.
Gavin McClurg (54:18.943)
Okay, excellent stuff, good stuff. But good luck in your preparation for the Worlds. Best of luck there. I've got my competition here in Utah that same time, so I unfortunately can't go to the Worlds this year. I would have loved to, but have fun and good luck. And can't wait to see you again in 27, but I'm sure I'll see you before then somewhere along the line. But thank you.
Celine Lorenz (54:44.247)
Thank you so much for having me and it really nice to talk with you. Thank you so much.
